Prospects unclear for town aid, social services if labor deal fails

Prague needs to go. She's a loose cannon and not helpful to any side in precarious negotiations. What's the saying about loose lips? Both Malloy and Prague suffer from this syndrome.

So anyway, I have some suggestions that don't include shredding the safety net or municipal aid.

Kill the ridiculous Nb to Htfd bus line.
Do not finish Rt. 11
Delay UConn Health Ctr expansion
Eliminate the special commissions - women, pan-asian, etc., etc.,

Note to union leaders: Next time include your membership when asking for concessions. This is 2011 and now we have the Internet to talk to each other. You will not be able to continue to shut us out.

Access to Facebook basically overthrew the Egyptian government. Why did Malloy, Dorman, Livinston, etc, think they could "blackout" the negotiation process?

Dear Edith,

Obviously you have not been paying attention. If you were you would know why we voted the deal down. Let me sum it up for you: Value Based Health Care, deception by union leaders, Malloy and Wyman, a proposal that results in a 1 1/2 pay increase over 4 years, and bullying.

And don't worry Edith, dear, you won't be getting a thing out of us either. Isn't it time that you retire? Or at least take your Aricept.

lets rally to get prague out of office. if anyone of u watched the phony susan lucci performance on hour 1 of the secrap video where she showed up at the state armory. what a liar she is cause we didint vote her way now she threatns to neva again give us anything... well lets vote her the hell out

Sen. Prague MAY be a bit of a loose cannon, but I think that there are going to be many state legislators who share the same sentiment if the concessions deal goes down. My gut instinct tells me that state employees are not likely to have many friends in the General Assembly.

Edith,

You once again have put your foot in your mouth. Don't worry. We won't ask for a penny from you. But we will we vote you out.

Wow, how dare Prague... Vote her out... She won't get a single vote from any state worker after that statement...

Paul, Right now I think the Democratic Legislature wont turn their back on the unions because here in CT that is to big of a part of what gets them elected. The issue they will have or better yet, Malloy will have is just like the article says, if he tries to take aid way from munies his own legislatures will need to prevent it because it will hurt their constituents and they will feel the backlash come election time. We all know these politicians are to power hungry to do anything that may cause them their positions in office.

This is a sad day for Connecticut.

Absolute Bombshell I just read.

This thing is not over.

I just read a direct quote from a high ranking Sebac union leader that states as follows:

"One union official Wednesday, who declined to be identified, argued it might be possible for leaders to hold a re-vote, which could even include a decision by labor leaders to re-write the rules outlining the passage threshold".

Did you get that last part about re-writing the rules for passage?

It ain't over. This thing is going to pass. I think it's great news.

Obviously Michael we never had any legislature friends.

Who do they think they are?? Lets get some shared sacrifice from them?? What has she given up and for that matter what did any of them give up?

Who exactly did and continues to make money problems by spend spend spend??

The state employees have done nothing to deserve any of this. WE dont do have anything to do with budgets. Always going after the little guy. Trying to make the like guy go to the poor house. It it time to vote people in for a term and that is it. Clearly they become corrupt if in any longer.

The elected officials are to blame. The arrogance of you Edith and the others, Healy, Mckinney all of you need to go.

What were you Edith doing at the armory totally inappropriate? Dan Livingston clearly in ____ with the elected officials.

We wont get a dime from YOU???? What?? I would think that you might want to look into an investigation regarding SEBAC. The practices that went on here are beyond outrageous. The censoring from the SEBAC website. Censoring by the media. THe CHART foundation.

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM

Quite frankly Art,

We dont want any of them. They all stink to high heaven. They are all rich and really dont know what is like to work.

I would like to throw them in a patrol car for a month. I would then like to put them to work at CVH for a month. Then I would like to throw them in a prison working for a month. I then would let them work in DCF for a month.

Then they might get it but probably not their arrogance is astounding.

In fact how about 45,000 employees not go to work and them maybe everyone will see exactly what state employees do. Everyone keeps quoting private sector seems to be a great word to throw around doesnt it.

For some reason we continue to be treated like garbage when we did nothing. In fact as I recall 725 million dollars was given back by state employees and what did anyone else give back?? I do not recall ANYONE GIVING ANYTHING BACK BUT STATE EMPLOYEES.

The nerve of these politicians and the public !!!!! Representive Healy says we gave zero and now EDith Pragure. It is ridiculous.

Let me know what the rank and file did but go to work and get a paycheck for the days work.

THis is not about the private sector again public employees did not create the money problems going on today. In fact why do you let one of us run the fiscal budget because if I dont have money I dont spend it period.

Enlighten me how UCONnn is going to produce 16000 jobs? Really and layoff 7500 makes sense to me after costing well over one billion dollars to build. I am sure much more than that since Uconn does not make money.

Give me a break!

I really dispise all of the hyperbole coming from our state leadership - "we'll need to shred the social safety net," "lay-off 4,500," no, wait, "lay-off 7,500," yea, that's the ticket! I am waiting for someone to echo Dr. Venkmen from the movie "Ghostbusters." I can hear it now: "Without this agreement, there will be riots in the streets, dogs and cats - living together, mass hysteria!"

We state employees are well aware of what programs are producing results and which are not. The state has audit reports, legislative program reviews and other quantifiable information that provides insight into state programs that are simply not producing. It may take a while, but we can trim the fat.

Consider this, the Department of Information Technology is responsible for keeping track of the status of all of the active IT projects of state agencies. Each agency is responsible for updating this report monthly. Apparently, the most recent report lists some $50,000,000 (that's FIFTY MILLION) worth of agency projects in a status of "failing." This information has been sent to the Governor's office each month for years. Perhaps these projects would be a good start!

Does everyone remember the site that Governor Rell put up in 2008 where we all could contribute our cost-saving ideas? Whatever happened to all that data? I recall seeing some really thoughtful and innovative ideas offered. Was that just political theater?

To me, the problem boils down a breakdown in role of politics in our republic:

* We have a representative form of government, yet often the decisions of our representatives are completely out of touch with those they serve.

* Politics today is a professional career. Our elected focus on staying employed. This is a self-fulfilling conflict of interest.

* The cost of a political campaign is so expensive that the everyman or everywoman simply cannot compete. Because of that, we have a whole cross-section of individuals who would make excellent representatives but do not have access to the resources to make it a race.

* Special interests, with their deep pockets, hijack the conversation.

* Many of those we elect do not possess the knowledge, skills or experience in the careers and disciplines that their committees oversee. For example, how many of those sitting on the Human Services Committee hold a Masters in Social Services? How many of them have served as a front-line social worker or child-protection worker? For that matter, how many of them have stepped-up to be foster parents? Yet they are responsible for passing legislation that frames how DSS or DCF conduct their business? Maybe the next time I need surgery, I'll go to the Boy Scout next door because he has a merit badge in first-aid. Yes, they are all well-intentioned, but you simply don't know what you don't know.

* It's acceptable for a political leader to lie to those he serves without penalty. Lie to Congress and you can go to jail - why isn't the reverse true? Politics should be a higher calling. Why aren't we demanding a higher standard?

* The state has many laws designed to ensure that state workers do not engage in a conflict of interest when making commitments for the state, yet we have legislation that permits state workers to Unionize. Collective Barganing is the single largest conflict of interest that exists in state government today. But I guess that's okay, because, you know, the state is more at risk becuse I happen to own a handful of shares of IBM stock. We have all these checks and balances in state government and in reality, it's more unethical than ever.

Maybe it's time to take back our Government?

afscme and seiu and other unions represent town and city union employees to. The union leaders made a calculation to let the state employees take a hit so their other unions would not. Aid to towns being cut will effect town and city union members. After the ggovernor asked for concessions he went on a massive spending spree which i compare to the neighbor we all have filing for bankruptcy one day, then the next driving sa loaded hummer home from the car lot. Not only is the guy with the hummer, having made bad fiscal decisions for a long time, he gets someone else to pay for his past mistakes, but continues the same bad behavior. The sebac peopole are complicit with the Governor by putting dues paying members against other dues paying members. It is sad that the union leaders and Governor try to put us out as the problem, when it is obvious to anyone who is paying attention that they are the problem. to the right wingers who are simple minded and can't see what we did by voting no, this was just phase one of putting everyone in the state on obamacare. The whole tea party movement was started over the health care debacle.we nipped it in the bud. a simple thank you would be nice.

@gotta_luv_ct: You raise many interesting points, but I believe there are a few things on some of your points that you failed to consider.

1) You talk about IT problems: the new negotiated agreement includes savings for utilizing new technologies and reduced licensing procurement and consulting costs. This may not address every issue, but it is a start.

2) You talk about the costs of political campaigns keeping regular people out, but CT is one of the few states that have passed a system of voluntary public financing so that more people can afford to run.

3) You talk about politicians wanting to win elections, but the idea with elections is that it is the best way to keep them accountable to their constituents. I know this does not always work the way it is supposed to work, but what is the alternative? Politicians who know they are not running again have even less incentive to listen to constituents (although I will also grant that they have less incentive to listen to lobbyists as well).

4) You say that representatives are often out of touch with their constituents, but how do we define this? Constituents hardly, if ever, agree with each other. I am not saying representatives should not listen to their constituents, but the issue is often complicated.

5) I agree that interests with money, time and access can often sway the process for their own ends rather than the ends of the majority of the people, but solving this problem is rather difficult. Public financing (see #2) is one way to try to do this. Yet with our commitment to free speech, and with the Supreme Court's interpretation that money=speech, it is very difficult to limit the influence of interests who want to sway our government.

I know I have not addressed all your points, but on these, I wanted to weigh in. I think the issues you raise are very, very important.

Dear Wigman:

Thank you for bringing that article to my attention. It is actually very interesting.

First, it does NOT say union members earn 11% LESS than those in the private sector, but rather 25% MORE. You really shouldn't try to play games like that. Yes, they did say that "adjusted for education," it came out less, but the reality is that public workers earn MORE.

Second, the methodology of this "study" was not disclosed. If you know anything about statistics you know that methodology determines outcome. For example, are they comparing straight salary to salary? Or are they comparing salary plus benefits? Plus time off? And how are they equating the education of one group to that of another?

Finally, and most importantly, your "economists" were professors at the University of Wisconsin, and as such they are UNION MEMBERS. How many times have I read complaints by union members here about statistics published by the Yankee Institute, a dastardly CONSEVERATIVE organization. For example, I think it was Josephine who in another string criticized a poll by the Yankee Institute showing that Malloy's approval rating was 42%. Obviously, she said, the Yankee Institute cannot be bellieved. Well, as it turned out Quinnipiac (if I remember right) came out with a poll showing the actual approval rating was 38%

Anyway, any statistics from any organization with an agenda is inherently suspect. Statistics about public union salaries from public union members are suspect. I certainly will not accept "adjusted" wages from union members with an agenda, showing public sector employees making 11% less than everyone else, when unbiased sources show they earn 25% MORE than comparable private sector employees.

Also, I am aware of what public sector employees get for benefits, and I know of no company that matches that. Back in the day, companies like General Motors (unionized) could easily match and surpass public sector employees, but you know what happened to them. (In case you don't they went bankrupt. The government bailed them out.)

So please, tell it like it is. Public sector employees earn on average 25% more than private sector employees doing the same job. And that may or may not include benefits. Probably not.

Myth busting for those in the private sector jealous of those in the public sector:

The average pension for a CT state retiree is $29,000 annually (this is high due to the high number of Tier 1 retirees. About 90% of all Tier 1 are retired and as they die off, the number will go down significantly)

The average pension for Tier IIa retiree is $11,000 annually (hardly enough to buy beach front property. People love to point out the few 6 figure pensions and try to get you to believe that this is the norm).

There actually studies that confirm that Public sector wages are LOWER than private sector http://www.slge.org/index.asp?Type=B_BASIC&SEC=%7B22748FDE-C3B8-4E10-83D... .

Quit the jealousy and envy. Focus on the real problem. The state is spending too much on non-essential garbage and blaming state workers for the budget problems they didn't create. Don't get sucked into this.

GOOD. Cut town aid. Make these towns that mainly overspent on their budgets from 1995-2008 finally have to practice financial responsibility. Why does the state have to pay their bills?

Cut it all.

Reduce Welfare.

Reduce Medicaid

Reduce Section 8 housing payments to slumlords - scummy landlords are filling their pockets with taxpayer dollars by not repairing houses they are MANDATED to fix

Cut Welfare for ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS too!

Repeal that STUPID bill that now provides college tuition to ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS

Degrees in the areas of liberal arts and the social sciences are not useless. College graduates for the most part are better able to communicate with others and have greater a greater ability to function in our society than their high school counterparts. Private sector companies religiously utilize liberal arts graduates in the areas of sales,marketing and management. It is true that person holding a degree in engineering, nursing, or medical sciences is apt to make more money in his or her lifetime, but a college degree is not a worthless piece of paper by any means.

Dear Art

I agree liberal art degrees are not worthless, but the question is should employees with a liberal art degree be paid more when the degree has absolutely nothing to do with their job? I think not. Or at least not much more. Sure, the ability to communicate is probably better for college graduates than for high school graduates, but the college graduates are also four years older. Ten years out, doing the same job can it really be said that most college grads are doing more than high school grads who have also done the job for 10 years.